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Post by fan on Oct 30, 2008 15:27:30 GMT -5
Every other villain but Shego is either a joke or uninteresting, imo. Not to mean that being a joke is a bad thing, but most of the villains are not that much of a threat, to anyone.
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Post by maetch on Oct 31, 2008 12:29:17 GMT -5
As much as I like Drakken and Shego's plotting, I've got to admit that they could've used a few less episodes with them.
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Post by Lawrence on Nov 6, 2008 15:58:20 GMT -5
For me Drakken and Shego, especially Shego, are the main reason why I watch and like Kim Possible. Episodes without Drakken and Shego aren't my favourite and I don't wacht them so often as the D/S episodes. And I must say, that they could made more episodes with them in the 4 Season. But to be honest, when I was watching Rappin' Drakken I felt that I'm watching a "Drakken & Shego Series" and not a Kim Possible Series.
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Post by PoisonousAngel on Nov 6, 2008 19:37:00 GMT -5
I would kill for a Drakken and Shego series.
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Post by Ninnik Nishukan on Nov 7, 2008 17:59:50 GMT -5
I would kill for a Drakken and Shego series. I would kick somebody in the shin for a Drakken and Shego series. Err...really hard in the shin? XD
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Post by Charlotte C on Nov 8, 2008 10:46:09 GMT -5
I would kill for a Drakken and Shego series. I would kick somebody in the shin for a Drakken and Shego series. Err...really hard in the shin? XD I would buy advertising time on a Drakken and Shego series. And I don't even have anything to advertise.
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Post by RedBlueGreen on Nov 8, 2008 11:20:40 GMT -5
No, they were never overexposed. We could have done with more of them. Drakken didn't diminish because he kept trying and failing (obviously, he was never going to take over the world, any more than Wil. E. Coyote was going to catch the Road Runner.) The best thing about them was their characters - annoying each other and making fiendish plots and the rest. I would kill for a Drakken and Shego series. I would kick somebody in the shin for a Drakken and Shego series. Err...really hard in the shin? XD Ron: So that's "the sitch". 22 episodes of Drakken and Shego, the series. More if it flies. We'll be in the supporting cast. Shego: Well, I'm flattered, but no. Semi-retired, doing the odd fanfic, we're good. Kim: Property of Disney, Shego! They want you for a series, you're doing a series! Lucky she took Ninnik's position and not PoisonousAngel's, eh? (Don't ask where Kim and Ron went in the forth picture.)
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Post by cadmus on Dec 20, 2008 3:29:42 GMT -5
No, they were never overexposed. We could have done with more of them. Drakken didn't diminish because he kept trying and failing (obviously, he was never going to take over the world, any more than Wil. E. Coyote was going to catch the Road Runner.) The best thing about them was their characters - annoying each other and making fiendish plots and the rest. Difference is, Road Runner was a slapstick comedy cartoon. Kim Possible is an action/comedy hybrid, meaning that 90% of the episodes end with the hero defeating the villain in a big action sequence, not a sitcom resolution. So you have to do something to up the ante, and I think thats what people aren't getting. I don't mean to come down on you or anyone else, but Drakken & Shego became stale many times throughout the series, and most of the so called "clever episodes" you guys penned them in, were the opposite of that. And them bickering didn't always become more clever every time they did it. Also the percentage of mediocre episodes D & S had IMO was way to high for them to be deserving of the number of appearances they had. And just because I know someone is going to ask, I'm going to list all the mediocre-bad episodes (that were Drakken and/or Shego centric) they had: -Naked Genius -Car Trouble -Job Unfair -Partners -Sick Day -Mother's Day -Showdown At The Crooked D -Bad Boy -Cap'n Drakken -The Mentor of Our Discontent -Clean Slate Also keep in mind that just because I didn't list an episode here doesn't mean it was a five star effort either. It was just above average. But for the constant number of appearances they had, they should've been delivering the goods consistently IMO.
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Post by Alexlayer on Dec 20, 2008 11:01:28 GMT -5
I'm going to list all the mediocre-bad episodes (that were Drakken and/or Shego centric) they had: -Naked Genius -Car Trouble -Job Unfair -Partners -Sick Day -Mother's Day -Showdown At The Crooked D -Bad Boy -Cap'n Drakken -The Mentor of Our Discontent -Clean Slate Oh, sure. "mediocre-bad", really, FOR YOU! Just because you didn't enjoy those episodes doesn't mean I didn't, and I'm pretty darn sure I wasn't the only one. Seriously, you should get that "If I did't like it, means it's bad" way of thinking out of your head.
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Post by cadmus on Dec 20, 2008 11:25:23 GMT -5
I'm going to list all the mediocre-bad episodes (that were Drakken and/or Shego centric) they had: -Naked Genius -Car Trouble -Job Unfair -Partners -Sick Day -Mother's Day -Showdown At The Crooked D -Bad Boy -Cap'n Drakken -The Mentor of Our Discontent -Clean Slate Oh, sure. "mediocre-bad", really, FOR YOU! Just because you didn't enjoy those episodes doesn't mean I didn't, and I'm pretty darn sure I wasn't the only one. Seriously, you should get that "If I did't like it, means it's bad" way of thinking out of your head. If you want to enjoy mediocrity then more power to you. You'll notice I didn't list ANY season 1 episodes. WHY? Because the way Drakken and Shego were used was consistantly clever unlike season 2 onwards which was very hit or miss. Also the only people claiming Drakken and Shego weren't over exposed are the die hard fans.
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Post by Donne on Dec 20, 2008 11:34:28 GMT -5
Oh, sure. "mediocre-bad", really, FOR YOU! Just because you didn't enjoy those episodes doesn't mean I didn't, and I'm pretty darn sure I wasn't the only one. Seriously, you should get that "If I did't like it, means it's bad" way of thinking out of your head. If you want to enjoy mediocrity then more power to you. You'll notice I didn't list ANY season 1 episodes. WHY? Because the way Drakken and Shego were used was consistantly clever unlike season 2 onwards which was very hit or miss. Also the only people claiming Drakken and Shego weren't over exposed are the die hard fans. Not true. It's a matter of opinion- that's why there's a poll! And the results speak for themselves. I'm not a "die hard fan" fan, as you put it, of Drakken and Shego, but I still think they weren't overexposed. They were the main villains of the series, yes, with some other villains-of-the-day to spice things up, but although their characters became more developed and even less "evil" as time went on, I don't think they suffered for it... although that might have happened had the series gone on for a much longer time. And I did actually really like many of the episodes you listed; "Bad Boy" is my favorite for Ron, but I think they kept Drakken and Shego true to character and well-written. One more thing: "Kim Possible is an action/comedy hybrid, meaning that 90% of the episodes end with the hero defeating the villain in a big action sequence, not a sitcom resolution." Ya-wha? Wouldn't that make each half-and-half? 50% each way?
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Post by cadmus on Dec 20, 2008 11:49:24 GMT -5
If you want to enjoy mediocrity then more power to you. You'll notice I didn't list ANY season 1 episodes. WHY? Because the way Drakken and Shego were used was consistantly clever unlike season 2 onwards which was very hit or miss. Also the only people claiming Drakken and Shego weren't over exposed are the die hard fans. Not true. It's a matter of opinion- that's why there's a poll! And the results speak for themselves. I'm not a "die hard fan" fan, as you put it, of Drakken and Shego, but I still think they weren't overexposed. This poll was done on a die hard Kim Possible site. The poll only speaks for what the fanbase thinks, not what casual fans &/or on/off viewers think. I thought Bad Boy was a lousy episode, whose only redeeming factor was Zorpox in act 3, but he didn't do enough to leave a lasting impression. The rest of the episode had lousy animation, unimaginative storyboarding, lackluster action, and too many stories taking place, instead of having focus on just 1 or 2 of them. Plus Drakken's antics as a "good person" were really, really, REALLY annoying. To each his own, I guess. A hybrid doesn't have to be a 50/50 combination of something. It can be 60/40, 80/20 etc..
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Post by Donne on Dec 20, 2008 16:38:30 GMT -5
Not true. It's a matter of opinion- that's why there's a poll! And the results speak for themselves. I'm not a "die hard fan" fan, as you put it, of Drakken and Shego, but I still think they weren't overexposed. This poll was done on a die hard Kim Possible site. The poll only speaks for what the fanbase thinks, not what casual fans &/or on/off viewers think. Point, but wouldn't the fans be the ones who already saw all/most of the episodes, and therefore be the best to decide? Hopefully, just being a fan of KP wouldn't mean a bias in Drakken and Shego's favor. Although most probably like them, we can still criticize our fandoms, as many topics here (including this one) evidence. I think we must agree to disagree, since it isn't of great importance to me if you pledge your loyalty to an episode you dislike. I did think of that, actually; it was just the phrasing. And often, the villains just end up stranded somewhere or somehow surviving an explosion, not just beaten up and carted off to jail. But I propose a truce, since our latest posts seem to be just a clash of opinion. I don't want to come off as rude to you, so please don't take this debate as such.
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Post by The Yetimonster on Dec 20, 2008 21:44:53 GMT -5
If you want to enjoy mediocrity then more power to you. Also the only people claiming Drakken and Shego weren't over exposed are the die hard fans. Sorry. Just because you say they're mediocre doesn't make it so. End of story. That's utterly subjective. Your 'IMO's' in post 27 are duly noted, but clearly you aren't paying much attention to them either. This poll was done on a die hard Kim Possible site. The poll only speaks for what the fanbase thinks, not what casual fans &/or on/off viewers think. Then why did you bother to make this a poll in the first place? You obviously weren't interested in finding out who here thought Drakken and Shego were over-exposed to begin with. You merely think they were overexposed and want to tell us about it, and then argue with those who didn't find them to be overused, which didn't require the freakin' poll in the first place.And now that the poll disagrees with you, you're completely dismissing it. lol. GOOD JOB! Maybe next time you want to tell us how you feel and have arguments, you should just do the thing that makes you look like less of a jackass (by taking a poll, which should generally be given in an unbiased way, putting it in a completely subjective thread, and then criticizing those who disagreed with your view, and then saying the poll didn't matter anyway) and simply make a thread telling us how you feel. Don't worry, those who disagree will still voice their opinions. This could've been a pretty good thread, if the OP wasn't failing so hard. I'm sure he'll have something to say about this post, but I probably won't care much. And, back on topic: I'm not if I would go as far as saying they were 'overexposed' but I definitely think their use could've been scaled back a bit. Maybe 5-6 fewer episodes across seasons 3-4. But, since they are the main protaganist's arch-foes, it kind of is inevitable that they'd get most of the villains' screentime. And, on a fanboy sidenote, I was always hoping to see more Duff Killigan, Seniors, and Motor Ed. ;D
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Post by slicknickshady on Dec 21, 2008 20:59:04 GMT -5
I don't think so.
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Post by cadmus on Dec 22, 2008 1:16:52 GMT -5
If you want to enjoy mediocrity then more power to you. Also the only people claiming Drakken and Shego weren't over exposed are the die hard fans. Sorry. Just because you say they're mediocre doesn't make it so. End of story. You could also make that same claim in vice versa. To see what everyone else's thoughts were on this, and as far as the poll; you ask why? I ask why not? A little touchy are we? Actually I wanted to see people's thoughts on this subject coming from this site, compared to outside the circle if you will. I also wanted to see what the people who claim D & S weren't overexposed had to say and if they had any objective claims to back up their views. But so far there hasn't been any claims that I can honestly call objective and/or unbiased. And you can complain about me calling them overexposed all you want, but at least I've gone in to objective details to back up my claims, and my opinions on this aren't based on nostalgia. You act as if the poll going against my opinion makes it fact, it doesn't; regardless of it's results either way. Well gee, I don't know what these last few posts are that I've done.[/sarcasm] And it was, I said that while Drakken and Shego were good characters, they didn't need to be seen as much as they were. I even gave an example using The Simpsons and a similar criticism on one of my all time favorite television characters (Homer Simpson). Sorry if I choose not to be a yes man who goes with the flow to make everyone happy, and be somebody who has their own independent opinion. Where did I say the poll didn't matter? Now your just putting words in my mouth. I'm sure they will, I pretty much expect it, and invite it. The only thing that disappoints me is that I have yet to see anyone that voted no give an objective claim, that's not based on nostalgia. Who says the poll failed? For that matter, how does this thread's post equal failure? And I won't care much about your opinion either if thats your attitude.
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Post by ArtsandCrafts on Dec 22, 2008 1:59:17 GMT -5
*Sits herself down with a bucket of Reeces Pieces*
Oh, this is fun to watch.
I voted "no". I enjoy watching Drakken and Shego, I like the interraction, and they are, after all, the main villains of the series, so it makes sense that they get plenty of episodes.
Although some extra Monkey Fist episodes would have been nice. Hell, some episodes with more villain screen-time in general would have been nice.
*Looks over the entire "debate"*
Good lord my dears, much as we love it, it's only a cartoon, no need to start going for blood. (No matter how entertaining that is to watch.)
*Kicks someone in the shin*
...
Well, that did not work.
Thanks Ninnik, now I'm getting sued for shin injury.
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Post by The Yetimonster on Dec 22, 2008 15:41:51 GMT -5
A couple of quick things, caddy:
1. You've provided not a single objective and non-biased reason for your own claims and opinions in this thread. They're all subjective, since they're based on your feelings, and not independent of your own perspective as a KP fan. In fact, not a single post in this thread has contained anything that could be called objective fact. There's a pretty big difference. The fact that you're saying things like 'IMO' and 'I felt' and etc. should make that blaringly obvious, but you're missing it.
Drakken and Shego appeared in 20 episodes(no, I don't know the actual number) in season 4 = objective fact.
Drakken and Shego apeared in way too many episodes in season 4, and this is why I feel that way = subjective opinion.
2. Just because someone hasn't provided a bunch of reasons for their opinion, doesn't make it less valid than yours, since we're already talking about something that's completely subjective anyway. Personal taste is always just personal taste. They didn't get sick of seeing Drakken and Shego, what else do they need to say? 'I enjoyed the characters' is a perfectly valid argument in this particular case. Not that people shouldn't justify their opinions, but demanding it and acting like what people have said isn't really relevant in this case is a bit much. You would just end up with a bunch of pointless qualitative reasons anyway, like yours.
3. You seem to be laboring under the misconception that I'm posting like this because I disagree with you. Not actually the case, as my last paragraph in my previous post should indicate. I just think this thread was flawed by your demands for 'objectivity' and lack of bias when such a thing is impossible even for you, and that you at least seem to think (maybe you don't) the things you say are factual, when they are actually farthest from.
The journalistic and scientific definitions of objectivity won't match this thread either, btw.
Maybe I'm overanalyzing this post a bit, but I'm also not the one demanding 'objective' facts to support an opinion about a cartoon tv show. And hopefully I've made it clear that my low opinion of this thread is not because of my feelings about Drakken and Shego, but how this thread has been presented to me by the OP, mostly on the second page. I wouldn't have made this second post, but it was obvious I didn't convey myself clearly the first time. now I can be done. my opinion still won't change, regardless of what anyone says.
Anyway, have a nice day and a Merry Christmas, if you celebrate that holiday.
And a ninja-edit for spelling errors that would make my 3rd grade teacher slap me.
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Post by cadmus on Dec 23, 2008 0:06:08 GMT -5
I love how you said you wouldn't care about my comments. But respond anyway. A couple of quick things, caddy: 1. You've provided not a single objective and non-biased reason for your own claims and opinions in this thread. Actually I've gone into great detail to back up my claims. And my claims, biased? Clearly your not reading my critiques cause I claimed that Drakken and Shego were great characters who were shown way too much (Especially in season 2, where they appeared in 20 out of 31 episodes). How is that biased? I love how you shoot down your own "objective fact" by saying you don't know. Drakken and/or Shego appeared in 13 episodes in Season 4. Do some research next time you don't know. Well those reasons still don't sound convincing standing next to my critiques. And my critiques are not based on nostalgia or deep character attachment like most of those who have posted here. Well if thats all they got, then its just not a very convincing argument. But it would be a more convincing argument, something I haven't seen yet from those who voted no. I'm gonna have to take a step back and say I had a different definition of objectivity in the back of my mind in the last few posts. The thing I was looking for when I said "objectivity" was a "convincing argument" from those who voted no to back up their claims, something they have yet to do. Yes I do, and a Merry Christmas to you to.
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Post by The Yetimonster on Dec 23, 2008 0:26:57 GMT -5
lol, okay. You've obviously not taken any college level stats/research methods classes so I'll just let this 'objectivity' stuff slide. I'm clearly not getting through your thick skull at all.
Enjoy your ignorance. I would suggest finding a different word, however.
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