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Post by GT on Sept 23, 2007 17:56:27 GMT -5
True.
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Post by Thorius Maximus on Sept 23, 2007 18:29:04 GMT -5
Not to mention that knowing several styles of Kung-Fu (without being a master at any of them) doesn't make any difference here for independently of how the strike is made and it's pressure, if the living creature is enough resistant and strong to sustain the attacks without any problem then they would be useless and the strength used against Kim would be more than enough to knock her out quickly (or worse) with few attacks or just one.
When fighting a being such as Warhok the only thing that matters is strength for martial arts can't give the necessary damage in speciffic spots(which always was her best chance) because Warhok is both stronger and more resistant. Also, if she approaches him then it would only take one chance for him to grab Kim and apply massive damage/pain with his superior strength.
As I said it's all a matter of strength vs strength as well as resistance.
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Post by mike on Sept 24, 2007 5:49:55 GMT -5
Not to mention that knowing several styles of Kung-Fu (without being a master at any of them) Just wondering about this. Did the show ever mentioned that she is or she is not a master of the 16-styles. I know that it wasn't mentioned that she is a master, but has it been mentioned that she isn't a master? I mean when you say you know 16 styles of kung-fu, it doesn't follow that you are master nor does it follow that you aren't. So to make it short is saying "she is not a master of the 16 styles of kung-fu" a fact or is it just an assumption? If it's a fact when did the show stated that she wasn't a master? just asking
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Post by Thorius Maximus on Sept 24, 2007 6:25:37 GMT -5
The show has only stated she knows 16 styles, the word master was never included, but it's fairly obvious she isn't a master, to only specialize in one style already requires a lifetime of effort and comitement, the only way you're practicing 16 style is without being a master in any of them and being more a jack of all trades.
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Post by mike on Sept 24, 2007 6:35:03 GMT -5
The show has only stated she knows 16 styles, the word master was never included, but it's fairly obvious she isn't a master, to only specialize in one style already requires a lifetime of effort and comitement, the only way you're practicing 16 style is without being a master in any of them and being more a jack of all trades. Her Nana already mastered a style of Kung-Fu at her age so in the KPverse, for one to master a kung-fu style doesn't need a lifetime.... Hence it isn't obvious that she isn't a master nor is it obvious that she is a master....
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Post by yvj on Sept 24, 2007 6:37:42 GMT -5
I think if Kim had mastered them at some point she would have mentioned actually "mastering" it or Ron would have boasted about it to her enemies or to hype her up in certain circumstances.
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Post by mike on Sept 24, 2007 6:41:15 GMT -5
Well we can always speculate, but not conclude..
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Post by AvinashTyagi on Sept 24, 2007 9:00:02 GMT -5
She wouldn't have gotten beat by her Nana, or by Hirotaka in those styles if she was a master
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Post by Thorius Maximus on Sept 24, 2007 12:08:02 GMT -5
The show has only stated she knows 16 styles, the word master was never included, but it's fairly obvious she isn't a master, to only specialize in one style already requires a lifetime of effort and comitement, the only way you're practicing 16 style is without being a master in any of them and being more a jack of all trades. Her Nana already mastered a style of Kung-Fu at her age so in the KPverse, for one to master a kung-fu style doesn't need a lifetime.... Hence it isn't obvious that she isn't a master nor is it obvious that she is a master.... That last statement is meerely supposition, and no clue or indication that she is as master at any of them was ever given. Second Nana was not told to be a master of ONE style by her age but only later on, second, it's one style, not 16 which means that my logic (and a realistic logic) still remains.
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Post by Luke Danger on Sept 24, 2007 16:16:02 GMT -5
Well, if we want to put Kim and Warhok in a equal fight, then we'd likely put them into a pair of planes and have them shoot eachother up. Winner would need more skill.
While a plane may have excelent stats, it's size might weakenm it via making it a easy-to-hit target.
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Post by mike on Sept 25, 2007 8:51:30 GMT -5
Her Nana already mastered a style of Kung-Fu at her age so in the KPverse, for one to master a kung-fu style doesn't need a lifetime.... Hence it isn't obvious that she isn't a master nor is it obvious that she is a master.... That last statement is meerely supposition, and no clue or indication that she is as master at any of them was ever given. Second Nana was not told to be a master of ONE style by her age but only later on, second, it's one style, not 16 which means that my logic (and a realistic logic) still remains. Dr.D.: At your Age, she trained with the xiaolin monks to perfect the ancient art of Paeng Lang Chuang kung-fu. - The Golden Years In grammar the word trained is in past form, hence at that time, the task was already done otherwise, it should have been: "At your Age, she was training with the xiaolin monks to perfect the ancient art of Paeng Lang Chuang kung-fu." or "At your Age, she starts training with the xiaolin monks to perfect the ancient art of Paeng Lang Chuang kung-fu." She wouldn't have gotten beat by her Nana, or by Hirotaka in those styles if she was a master It doesn't follow that if you're beaten you're not a master
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Post by AvinashTyagi on Sept 25, 2007 11:17:31 GMT -5
It doesn't follow that if you're beaten you're not a master No, but it does show that you are not as skilled, and Master's of an art are usually among the best in the world, her defeats reveal that she is not, at best she is above average
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Post by Thorius Maximus on Sept 25, 2007 11:38:38 GMT -5
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Post by mrmatt on Sept 25, 2007 22:45:20 GMT -5
Note that it says she knows 16 styles, nothing about mastering any of them, and remember how she lost to Hirotaka Actually I wouldn't say she lost to Hirotaka, he broke off and niether landed a serious hit. As for Warhok it would be a fight for sure. She did drop him out of those jet pack wings of his. In the end I think she could take him if she wasn't grabbed. He's big enough that if he gets a hold you her its probably over.
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Post by AvinashTyagi on Sept 25, 2007 22:50:55 GMT -5
Note that it says she knows 16 styles, nothing about mastering any of them, and remember how she lost to Hirotaka Actually I wouldn't say she lost to Hirotaka, he broke off and niether landed a serious hit. As for Warhok it would be a fight for sure. She did drop him out of those jet pack wings of his. In the end I think she could take him if she wasn't grabbed. He's big enough that if he gets a hold you her its probably over. He was never trying to hurt her, but you could see that she wasunable to continue, which is why he broke off, because she wasn't able to continue and would have been hurt. Yeah but in that scene she had help from Ron to get her into position, without Ron she'd be at a disadvantage
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Post by mike on Sept 26, 2007 4:29:51 GMT -5
Well at least its now clear that she's not or is a master... and that's all I wanted to hear ;D It doesn't follow that if you're beaten you're not a master No, but it does show that you are not as skilled, and Master's of an art are usually among the best in the world, her defeats reveal that she is not, at best she is above average Actually her defeats proves nothing, did you ever considered that Nana is a master, and that Hirotaka might also be one, even as a student. In the end we can't conclude whether Kim is or isn't a master. We can only speculate.
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Post by Thorius Maximus on Sept 26, 2007 4:45:35 GMT -5
Well at least its now clear that she's not or is a master... and that's all I wanted to hear ;D No, but it does show that you are not as skilled, and Master's of an art are usually among the best in the world, her defeats reveal that she is not, at best she is above average Actually her defeats proves nothing, did you ever considered that Nana is a master, and that Hirotaka might also be one, even as a student. In the end we can't conclude whether Kim is or isn't a master. We can only speculate. What Nana may or may not be has nothing to do with her fight with Hirotaka. Second, no clue about Hirotaka being a master was given, after all, he IS a student thus nt a master, mostly likely an adept, if he beat Kim or at least outbest her, which he did in a face to face match without any unfair advantages, thus meaning that Kim does not seen to be at his level of training and expertise. If Kim lost then she lost, end of story, she simply wasn't at his level. Does she have to win everytime? You can not state that Kim is a master because no clues have been given, but you can state that she is an adept or a jack of trades because of the indications the show gives in general. And the whole "speculation" is completely avoidable in many arguments, you repeat the same argument again and again in almost every post and not because it's necessary, one thing is necessary caution, the other is a repetivive statement that doesn't help with the argument, this does not lead anywhere, if you have an indication or more than one then that's a start and then gives valid logic. This is getting unecessarely repetitive, I've stated all I had to say.
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Post by mike on Sept 26, 2007 5:14:11 GMT -5
You can not state that Kim is a master because no clues have been given, but you can state that she is an adept or a jack of trades because of the indications the show gives in general. For the record I am not saying that Kim is a master what I'm trying to say is that neither of us here can say that Kim is not a master.
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Post by Thorius Maximus on Sept 26, 2007 7:13:19 GMT -5
You can not state that Kim is a master because no clues have been given, but you can state that she is an adept or a jack of trades because of the indications the show gives in general. For the record I am not saying that Kim is a master what I'm trying to say is that neither of us here can say that Kim is not a master. That's where I once again disagree, it's not a mater of uncertainty, it's a mater of logic and indications from the series. First, as I said said before the series gives no indications that she is a master, second, if she was a master then her performance again opponents such as Hirotaka and others would have been better and the consquences of her being a master would have been reflected in general throughout the entire series and, he is equal to Yori in terms of efficiency, and Yori once again is a student. So, is there indication that she is a master? No. Is there indication she is an adept and at the same level as the Yamanuchi students= Yes, and several indications. Thus the conclusion is that most likely she would be in the adept level and may also know it and bits of other martial arts of which are given clues and indications (some of them quite direct), while on the other hand there is absolutely no indication, be it either direct of indirect that she is a master in any of them, thus the line thought that she is a master in any of them is completely unfounded and ilogical in terms of minimably realistic lines of thought and also according to what the series showed. Last post on this issue, cya.
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Post by mike on Sept 26, 2007 7:25:38 GMT -5
So, is there indication that she is a master? No. Is there indication she is an adept and at the same level as the Yamanuchi students= Yes, and several indications. Of course there's no indication that she is a master and I agree with that. What I am saying here that there is also no indication that she is not a master, so to tell that she is or is not a master is therefore unknown....
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