axavierb
Pink Sloth
The NEW Resident Slash Shipper
Posts: 5
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Post by axavierb on Sept 26, 2008 3:11:56 GMT -5
OK, OK, I already know that this has been discussed before. I've seen other topics about it, but I think it's really interesting and I want to discuss it more in-depth. My question here is, just how evil is Shego, really? Is she a killer, or does she have boundaries?
Everyone who discusses this seems to bring up the fact that Shego has never killed anyone. She has the power to kill, but she never has. Her energy blasts can be set to melt through steel, yet she never uses that force when firing at a living target. When fighting someone else, she only uses enough energy to knock them out. If she was a killer, wouldn't she vaporize them?
Yet at the same time, she's tried to kill Kim several times before. She's tried to chop her up in a giant blender, tried to send her falling to her death and tried to fire a deadly laser at both her and Ron. Would this indicate that Shego only kills when it's part of her job? Her job is to stop Kim from stopping Drakken, so would she kill Kim purely as a matter of business and not out of cold blood?
But whenever Shego does get a chance to kill Kim, she just settles for imprisoning her. A possible explanation could be that Shego only uses deadly force on Kim when she expects her to escape, but when she knows Kim truly can't defend herself, she holds back.
A weird thing is people bring up her hesitancy to kill the fish in the lake and to steal Felix's wheelchair. But if you notice, she went along with those plans anyway, even though she disapproved. Is it possible that her dislike toward the ideas was not because of morality, but just because she thought those things were childish and below her as a villain?
The reason I'm bringing this up is because I'm admittedly a blind Shego fanboy who hates to admit that she's pure heartless evil, so I've been trying to find redemption in her character, reassurance that she's not a bad person. But I'm really not sure if she's just a criminal or if she's actually a sadist who enjoys hurting and even killing people. The way she holds back from killing people seems to contradict the way she willingly goes along with Drakken's schemes that usually involve global destruction and death on a huge scale or the way she happily puts Kim and Ron into death traps. Does the woman have swings in morality or something?
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Post by lecter on Sept 26, 2008 11:58:44 GMT -5
I dont know, she can be cold and probably will kill someone if he/she gets in her way,but usually she seems more laid back.I think she has a limit when it comes to hurting people(Car alarm may be proof of me being wrong though,but still she did cringe at the though of Drakken stealing the wheelchair from a kid who is a invalid)
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Post by lecter on Sept 26, 2008 11:59:27 GMT -5
And i have nothing against Felix
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Post by Alexlayer on Sept 26, 2008 12:23:47 GMT -5
The answer is simple: It's ambiguous, PERIOD.
Like you said, her behavior in some episodes contradict others. One has to keep in mind that the show has been done NOT just by Mark, Bob and Steve, but by several writter who not always portray the characters in the same way. Episodes like "Stitch in Time" or "Car Alarm" have shown her as destructive and even sadist, but others like the one with Felix or that fish case show that she may be a villain, but she has "standars", a sort of morality that lets her go bad, but not low. Besides, being Shego, it's easy to believe that what she says is not always what she means, at least that's my opinion.
Don't try to take a "absolute" on her personality, because the show is anything but solid when it comes to that.
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Post by Cody MacArthur Fett on Sept 26, 2008 12:38:37 GMT -5
Well, it's to my understanding that the only reason she's not shown actively killing people (besides it being Disney) is because she wants to cause people as much pain and suffering as humanly possible, and she can't do that if they're dead. Of course, there's also the possibility that she's mentally unstable and has either completely lost her moral compass or switches personalities like people change clothes.
However, that doesn't stop me from making her a redeemable character in fanfiction ala Darth Vader.
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Post by Ashfangirl20 on Sept 26, 2008 19:57:37 GMT -5
Hmm I wonder if it wasn't Disney would she go over board and kill as many people as she'd want?
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Post by fireandchutes77 on Sept 27, 2008 14:34:53 GMT -5
Well, it's to my understanding that the only reason she's not shown actively killing people (besides it being Disney) is because she wants to cause people as much pain and suffering as humanly possible, and she can't do that if they're dead. That's my take on it, anyways. [plug] This excerpt from "The After" sums up my thoughts on the subject: ================ “....Don’t try any of that gun-kata **** on me, Possible,” Shego barked sharply, breathing hard, staring cross-eyed at the barrel planted between her eyebrows, “Don’t try to be a cute little hero. You’ll get us both killed. This ain’t Ultraviolet.” She carefully changed her tone, burying her terror and transmogrifying it into trademark arrogance. “You’ve had that little pop-job, what, two months…? I’ve had mine ever since some two-bit drug runner tried to feel me up in Costa Rica… …Took me for-eeeever to polish his name off the barrel…” “So why didn’t you pull this thing out before now?” Kim demanded, swallowing overwhelming panic and desperately fighting for time as the rim of Shego's gunbarrel burned like ice against her skin. Shego shrugged, throwing up a façade of cool. “I have. Picked it up in my merc years between Team Loser and Blueberry.” As she continued to talk, she gained control, and fed off it. “I like to use the Glow when I can; leaves less collateral. No blood evidence, fewer murders to bump me up the hot list, no bullets to trace, perfect for evidence control, and the EMP effect wipes the slob’s short-term memory so they never saw me… just a big blank space… They think they whacked their heads or something.... "With the whole superpower shtick, I really didn’t need the pistol. But when you’re talkin’ underworld, Possible, you’re talkin’ the bottom of the barrel. Hitmen so stupid they barely know how to stand. Not everybody knows what the pulsating green energy coming out of my palms is… But everybody knows what a gun is.” “So why not me? All this time, all those fights, you could have pumped me, easy.” The woman again rolled her shoulders noncommittally. “Never found that I needed to use it. First time around, with that stupid tick-thing, you caught me without it. After that, I realized that fighting you was… fun. It was adrenaline. It was a charge that nothing else could match. You and I are adrenaline junkies, Possible, don’t deny it. Snowboards, explosions, standing on the ramp, waiting for the jumplight… That’s your addiction. That’s your heroin. As for me… the gymnastics… judo… karate… jetboarding… hot cars… hotter jets… skydiving… high-speed chases from the Go days… X-Sports… They’d all worked for a while. Made me feel alive. And then when I got into the underworld… taking stuff that wasn’t mine and getting away with it… It’s a rush, Possible, believe me. “After a while, though, it got less effective, less powerful. Didn’t relax me anymore. Even the small-time stuff started getting lame. I tried getting into other stuff… Didn’t work. Just for the record, amps suck. They buzz you for a little while, but leave you feeling like naco afterward. It ain’t real. For the PSA, Straight-Edge, don’t do ‘em. They cost a few dozen spa treatments, and frankly, pun’kin, the guys that push ‘em ain’t exactly beefcakes. Adrenaline’s better than any drug… Still, you can build up tolerance to it. I was getting bored out of my skull while Drakken was in his start-up stages…” Her face changed, softening somehow. “…And then… You came along… You were the only one who came close to matching me… It was amazing. The closer you pushed me toward death, the more I knew I’m alive… And I figured if I put a bullet in your brains, it’d get boring again. Killing you would wreck the all-mighty status quo.” “Thanks…” Kim snarled, “I’ll remember that the next time you dunk me in a giant cake mixer.” “Oh, don’t get me wrong, Possible, I’ve wanted you dead… But... just… temporarily dead. I’m sure you’ve thought the same…” Whether by design or strange accident, Shego’s bangs parted slightly to reveal the white scar running down the side of her temple. “But I have I ever wanted you dead dead dead? Nah. Offing you is just as much a part of the job as the Señors leaving you and the deathtrap alone by your lonesome… ’Sides, killing somebody isn’t any fun. Too quick. Too easy. Too final.” She flashed a thin, icy smile. “The thrill of smashing somebody within an inch of their lives… Knowing that just one more punch will send them into oblivion… Holding back… Holding that power… Holding… ” She broke off, face twisting with a kind of a disconnected ecstasy.... ======================== |
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Post by vampirenaomi on Sept 27, 2008 14:48:17 GMT -5
I believe that even Monkey Fist has limits, so I certainly don't see Shego as a heartless killer who will go to any lengths to achieve what she wants. Unlike him, she has shown signs of humanity and it's not that farfetched of an idea that she has her own honour code.
Episodes like A Sitch in Time certainly make her seem like she's pure evil, but I agree with Alexlayer when he says she's an ambiguous character in that regard. She can go either way depending on the context.
And by the way, I hate the idea that making the villains commit the worst crimes known to humanity is in-character simply because they might do that if KP wasn't a Disney series. Sure, they'd probably be murdering and torturing people left and right if this was some hardcore adult series, but it isn't. If it's well explained in the context (and I'm now talking about fanfiction) then it's okay, but I'm not going to buy that mass murder is Shego's favourite hobby just because she's a villain.
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Post by Knife Wife on Sept 27, 2008 23:10:55 GMT -5
I don't see her as cold-blooded. I've adopted the theory that she became a villain a)as a "take that!" to her brothers, and b)because she was bored and villainy is fun. We've seen that she has some standards, but the writers often willingly sacrifice continuity, sometimes for something as small as a gag.
Must... resist... joke...
can't... hold... out...
GAH!
IT'S OVER 9000!!!!
I'm so sorry.
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Post by Ot@ru on Sept 28, 2008 3:39:56 GMT -5
Shego is very evil...
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axavierb
Pink Sloth
The NEW Resident Slash Shipper
Posts: 5
|
Post by axavierb on Sept 29, 2008 0:25:21 GMT -5
Oh, no one's denying that Shego's evil. She's very cruel and she's not a very good person to associate with, but I'm just asking how evil she is. As in, would she enjoy committing mass murder and genocide like Hitler, or would she consider that taking it too far? I agree that the continuity fluctuates sometimes, or perhaps she has unstable morals or something. Some of Drakkens schemes, which she participated in, would have killed thousands of people if they were successful. Of course, Shego probably knows he'll fail. Must... resist... joke... can't... hold... out... GAH! IT'S OVER 9000!!!! WHAT?! 9,000?! |
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Post by Prof. Joel Chen on Sept 30, 2008 15:36:08 GMT -5
She's probably as evil as it gets. After she got reverse-polarized (or umpolung'ed, as I like to think of it) in Stop Team Go, Wade commented that "you won't find a nicer person."
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Post by RedBlueGreen on Oct 2, 2008 5:52:50 GMT -5
Must... resist... joke... can't... hold... out... GAH! IT'S OVER 9000!!!! WHAT?! 9,000?! Dragonball Z, becoming a meme. Apparently. Still, I laughed, and I only got it from this. Clearly, Shego's evil must be measured in kilonazisShego's evil fluctuates just like everything else in the series - Kim's luck and ability, Ron's bumbling, Drakken's competence (and evil), Wade's hacker skills - as the the plot demands. Maybe she's not that worried about huge casualites: she doesn't know any of them. Maybe both she and Drakken have a disconnect between people they meet and people as crowds. She thought stealing a wheelchair was low, but doesn't mind covering Wisconsin in magma. As for the fish, I don't she was worried about hurting them, just curious about what happened to them when they sucked the water. |
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Post by mike on Oct 2, 2008 6:05:58 GMT -5
I don't see her as cold-blooded. I've adopted the theory that she became a villain a)as a "take that!" to her brothers, and b)because she was bored and villainy is fun. We've seen that she has some standards, but the writers often willingly sacrifice continuity, sometimes for something as small as a gag. Must... resist... joke... can't... hold... out... GAH! IT'S OVER 9000!!!! It's over 10k LOL ;D |
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Post by Charlotte C on Oct 2, 2008 9:33:58 GMT -5
Maybe she's not that worried about huge casualites: she doesn't know any of them. Maybe both she and Drakken have a disconnect between people they meet and people as crowds. She thought stealing a wheelchair was low, but doesn't mind covering Wisconsin in magma. That reminds me of this quote: One death is a tragedy; a million is a statistic. -Joseph Stalin |
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Post by Firelady Nemo on Oct 6, 2008 16:35:19 GMT -5
I'm not sure about her evil. I mean.. unlike a lot of villains, she didn't turn evil because of a bunch of aangst in her life or anything like that. The way she talks makes it sound like she made the choice to be evil for fun or something. I know a lot of fanfiction writers like to protray her past as gruesome or depressing, but i think possible, she just made the decision on her own. Anyone remember her on "A Sitch in time?" She wanted to put Kim Possible on the TV thing so people could "watch her suffer!" Then, there are other times, such as MDAA, where she goes as far as to save kim. So.. who's to tell... She may have just simply "grown out" of evil with season 4. The creators sortof left it un-answered whether or not shes good or evil now. In my opinion, I can't really see her completely going good. Honestly, I prefer her as still evil. but honestly who knows about her "level of evil" Judging from "bad boy" it's pretty high, though    ...Mabye she's changed.. but i think it would be REALLY hard to make your evillness go down that quickly! |
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Post by RedBlueGreen on Oct 6, 2008 17:48:33 GMT -5
That reminds me of this quote: One death is a tragedy; a million is a statistic. -Joseph Stalin Disney cartoon to Joseph Stalin in so few moves. I thought of the same quote. As I said on the last discussion on this topic, Evil is different on KP. It's big, flamboyant schemes involving robots, giant lasers and mind control devices, but you can still go on a beach holiday if it doesn't work out. Shego might go for sinking Japan, but not stealing old people's pensions. Robbing banks, but not mugging, which is too small-time. |
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Post by Knife Wife on Oct 6, 2008 18:41:05 GMT -5
Actually, I don't think that device really measures evil. It probably measures strength (like those things you see at carnivals). Think about it. Hench's primary buyer would be mad scientists. They tend to be relatively weak (especially compared to their hired help), so when they use it, it says they're not very evil, and they buy an Attitudinator to "fix" the problem. Hench gets money and the villains are none the wiser.
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Post by kimxron on Oct 6, 2008 22:23:38 GMT -5
I don't think she would kill anyone like any other villain would.. lets say Scar from the Lion King! She would be the villain who wants to take over the world but like the ones she is annoys with, like..idk control them or something instead of killing them!
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Post by RedBlueGreen on Oct 8, 2008 14:02:31 GMT -5
Actually, I don't think that device really measures evil. It probably measures strength (like those things you see at carnivals). Think about it. Hench's primary buyer would be mad scientists. They tend to be relatively weak (especially compared to their hired help), so when they use it, it says they're not very evil, and they buy an Attitudinator to "fix" the problem. Hench gets money and the villains are none the wiser. Ooh, sneaky, ingenious and it I can completely see it working. |
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