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Post by surforst on Apr 18, 2006 13:40:40 GMT -5
Now I know some of you love to death the whole she said he said bit and you all know my opinion on it but I've got to ask why this.
Kim smiled at Ron and said "Is that a naked mole rat in your pocket," Kim brushed back Ron hair and said "Or are you just happy to see me."
Ron said "Nah it's just Rufus." Grinning he said "And I am happy to see you."
Kim said. "That's good to hear but why do we have to keep saying 'said'." Frowning she said. "I mean you'd figure they would figure out which one of use was talking by this point."
Ron shrugged and said. "I dunno I think Surforst is trying to make a point." Ron sighed and said. "Like usual though he tends to go on and on instead of just finishing this."
Well that's my example and the point I'm trying to make is why do you have to put 'said' more then once. If you follow the whole 'new speaker means new paragraph' rule then why? I just don't get it.
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Post by Mr. Dubois a.k.a IvyMae on Apr 18, 2006 14:06:26 GMT -5
"Perhaps people don't know of any other good words to use besides said?" Ivy replied while contemplating the issuse that Surfrost presented. "And while we are on that subject, why do people interjet another person's dialogue while in the middle of another person's dialogue?"
Ivy paused for a moment to collect her thoughts before continuing, "For example, let's say I was talking and then I stopped." Suddenly she stopped. "What's wrong?" asked Ron, further illustrating Ivy's point.
"I always thought that when a new person spoke, you started a new paragraph, and not placed their quotes inside the paragraph of the previous speaker, " She looked pointedly at Ron, "but then again that's me."
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Post by DrMike on Apr 18, 2006 14:15:32 GMT -5
Can't believe I'm giving English writing assistance here. My old high school english teacher would have a fit. We didn't get along much. He hated math majors. Actually I try not to say "said" that many times. You work in a better method of giving a motion (ie Ron shrugged) in the last line. Here's yours: I would go with something like this: How's that?  |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2006 16:20:58 GMT -5
Heh.... I cannot stand it when it comes down to using "said" for each line. I, for one try to avoid it as much as possible. Actions can easily take the place of the 'he said she said' nonsense.
"How many times do you use said?" Ron asked quizzically, rubbing the back of his neck, an unsuccessful attempt to keep confusion from looking obvious.
"Never!" I replied defiantly, "Well, maybe once or twice if it's absolutely necessary."
"Oh..." Ron began, not fully comprehending my completely insignificant example. "Well, I'm going to Bueno Nacho."
It goes without saying, the young blonde rushed to his newly acquired girlfriend. "Hey KP, We'd better hurry," he grinned.
"Huh? Hurry where?" Looking toward the naked molerat on Ron's shoulder, she arched an eyebrow.
Taking her hand in his, Ron couldn't resist broadening his trademark grin, "You'll see..."
When someone has to use the "said" more than once within a certain amount of the story, it seems to me like a lack of effort. DrMike has shown a perfect example of how it could have been written, and it probably didn't take much more effort. But yes, I know what you mean surfrost. I really cannot see how some people can use it that many times without thinking that it sounds redundant.
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Post by dragoonbigl on Apr 18, 2006 16:34:39 GMT -5
I've always felt a bigger problem than the "said" thing was over use of pronouns and such in general. His, Her, thier, Kim, Ron, He, She
Kim did this. Kim did that. Then Kim did this. Then she did that.
Its hard to form paragraphs that can keep tense and person without lacking flow. I'm constantly staring at my paper trying to form the sentences in my mind. I know what I want the characters to do, imagining it up is the easy part, getting it to flow on the paper is the hard part.
Of course who wants to think about english anyway!!! I just wanna get my story on paper!!! ARGH!! If only I could blow my nose to spray all my thoughts onto the paper and then scan it to get the words on the screen!
Course I'm probably the only person on the planet that can't type a story directly. Anyone else here kill pencils like I do? Ivy doesn't count, she's probably slain so many writing utensils its not funny. lol
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LycoX
Yellow Trout
Chaos bringin' through out the nation!
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Post by LycoX on Apr 18, 2006 16:39:32 GMT -5
ya know, i never much paid attention to the he said she said thing, until now that is.
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Post by captainkodak1 on Apr 18, 2006 16:56:31 GMT -5
I attempt to get away from the he said she said thing. I will have the character in some sort of action to tell the reader who is speaking or have the other characters name in the dialouge. I am trying to do better but it just takes practice.
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Post by surforst on Apr 18, 2006 17:22:34 GMT -5
Can't believe I'm giving English writing assistance here. My old high school english teacher would have a fit. We didn't get along much. He hated math majors. Actually I try not to say "said" that many times. You work in a better method of giving a motion (ie Ron shrugged) in the last line. Here's yours: I would go with something like this: How's that? *cough* I wasn't asking for advice just bringing up a concern that's all. Anyway glad to see others agree with me and I pray to God some of the authors who do this see my point too. I'm of the firm belief you don't need to ever use 'said' in a story and personally I avoid it like it was a rule in my religion. That's just me though. |
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Post by captainkodak1 on Apr 18, 2006 17:41:44 GMT -5
Hehe,
Sorry Surfrost, meant to write it another way not like advice. I had just taken a good dose of my pain medicine. It's strong enough to curl your toes. I agree. I try to use the "said" word very rarely.
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Post by surforst on Apr 18, 2006 17:53:49 GMT -5
Hehe, Sorry Surfrost, meant to write it another way not like advice. I had just taken a good dose of my pain medicine. It's strong enough to curl your toes. I agree. I try to use the "said" word very rarely.  Kay? Anyway I'm just making sure everyone knows I don't usually write like that but I was just instead writing an example. That's all. ;D |
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Post by bubbahotek on Apr 18, 2006 22:51:25 GMT -5
I have to admit I do fall prey to both problems. I just try to mix it up as much as I can and still try to make the story sensible.
Bubba
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Post by taechunsa on Apr 19, 2006 3:29:29 GMT -5
The book on writing dialogue that I read list this area (the adjective, adverb, and inappropriate tag addiction) as the number two biggest mistake in writing dialogue.
It stresses using identifier tags sparingly. It suggest using action narrative to point out who is speaking.
At the same time it stresses that needlessly changing to other words (expostulated, regaled, pontificated, etc.) is a sign of an amateur author.
It also rails against the use of nearly any adjective or adverb in the identifier. Instead the state of the speaker should be represented in the speech or through action. Don't say that the speaker said something angrily, show it through action and speech.
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Post by RavenStar on Apr 19, 2006 3:51:58 GMT -5
Wow, that's a horribly written exchange. That can be shrunk down easily.
Kim smiled, brushing his hair back. "Is that a naked mole rat in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?"
Ron grinned. "Nah, it's just Rufus."
"That's good, but - why do we have to keep saying 'said'? I mean, you'd think they'd figure out which one of us was talking by now..."
Ron shrugged, sighing. "I dunno. I think Surforst is trying to make a point. Like usual, he tends to go on and on instead of just finishing this..."
Also, side note to surforst: I'm not trying to offend you here, but but you should check your punctuation. You've got periods at the end of questions, no commas where there should be commas, and commas where there should either be a period or no commas (unless that was purposefully done, that is, then just ignore this bit).
Nice to bring up this point, though. I don't know how many stories I've read where it's "Kim said/Ron said/Wade said/"...
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Post by surforst on Apr 19, 2006 4:05:16 GMT -5
All errors were intentional or just plain ignored. Trust me I don't write like this people just trying to bring up a point. Anyway I'm with taechunsa guide on this one. Better to show someone talking then tell the reader their talking.
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Post by bubbahotek on Apr 19, 2006 19:32:58 GMT -5
The book on writing dialogue that I read list this area (the adjective, adverb, and inappropriate tag addiction) as the number two biggest mistake in writing dialogue. It stresses using identifier tags sparingly. It suggest using action narrative to point out who is speaking. At the same time it stresses that needlessly changing to other words (expostulated, regaled, pontificated, etc.) is a sign of an amateur author. It also rails against the use of nearly any adjective or adverb in the identifier. Instead the state of the speaker should be represented in the speech or through action. Don't say that the speaker said something angrily, show it through action and speech. I'm going to try this on my next chapter of Aliyah, I am using said and he, she, Ron and Kim to death...Hopefully this will become a more comfortable writing style for me. Bubba |
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Post by Ezbok58a on Apr 19, 2006 19:46:09 GMT -5
All errors were intentional or just plain ignored. Trust me I don't write like this people just trying to bring up a point. Anyway I'm with taechunsa guide on this one. Better to show someone talking then tell the reader their talking. Yeah, at least with the stories you have spell check, here it's all off of memory, which usually sucks due to some form of lazyness or ADD......... A Paper Bag Blowing in the wind! This I gotta see! |
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Post by Artificial Moose on Apr 19, 2006 19:49:25 GMT -5
Well that's my example and the point I'm trying to make is why do you have to put 'said' more then once. If you follow the whole 'new speaker means new paragraph' rule then why? I just don't get it. Can't speak for anyone else, but here are two reason why I would use a "said" block more than once in a given conversation. 1. If the conversation is between three or more characters, who alternate in addressing each other. 2. If I feel the need to state, not just that someone has spoken, but how they spoke. Translation of #2: I love me adverbs and adjectives. ;D Tom Swifties are fun, too. |
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Post by campy on Apr 20, 2006 8:48:34 GMT -5
Tom Swifties are fun, too. "KP, there are too many guards; there's no way we can sneak into that embassy," Ron said disconsolately. ;D |
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Post by Artificial Moose on Apr 20, 2006 17:45:49 GMT -5
"KP, there are too many guards; there's no way we can sneak into that embassy," Ron said disconsolately. ;D Dude...   |
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Post by bubbahotek on Apr 20, 2006 23:57:56 GMT -5
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Kay? Anyway I'm just making sure everyone knows I don't usually write like that but I was just instead writing an example. That's all. ;D
