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Post by rd on May 2, 2008 0:29:24 GMT -5
No need to meddle with perfection.
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Post by Ashley Benlove on May 2, 2008 6:50:39 GMT -5
I said no.
Like, RD. No need to meddle with perfection.
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May 2, 2008 16:02:03 GMT -5
Post by littlemissruthie on May 2, 2008 16:02:03 GMT -5
I wouldn't, like what the two previous users said.
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Post by The Nine Tailed Smiley on May 3, 2008 9:54:05 GMT -5
Me neither!!
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Post by Ot@ru on May 4, 2008 2:13:39 GMT -5
There's no need for change
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Jigsaw
Yellow Trout
"Live or die, make your choice."
Posts: 137
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Change?
May 4, 2008 14:56:47 GMT -5
Post by Jigsaw on May 4, 2008 14:56:47 GMT -5
I can't believe some people think it was perfect. STD is not perfect, it's the biggest mess I have ever seen in my life. Honestly, do the writers actually expect people to believe that Kim's feeling for Ron were natural? I'm about to go on a long rant, I'm sorry that it's so long but it sums up everything that is wrong with STD: When Bonny told Kim that she needs to get a date or she would end up with the chess captain, then Ron runs into the gym and then she says "or worse" (Implying that Kim would end up with Ron) she has a horrified look on her face. Then at the lockers she is sad when she sees that ever other girl has a boyfriend but her, then Ron shows up and he says that he thinks he knows what she is sad about and Kim turns around with a gasp and a shocked look on her face and then Ron guesses wrong and she then sighs. Now this the part where most K/R fans think that she gasped because she was expecting him to ask her out and that she sighed at the end because he didn't. This is wrong because it is completely contradicted by the scenes that follow. The real reason why she gasped was because she was worried that he WAS going to ask her out and then sighed in relief when he didn't. after Kim signs his petition, she says "no big" and Ron says "No, way big, I can always count on you." This always sounded like Ron was trying to hint to her that he was interested in her. Even though he wasn't, Kim thought he did and walked away with another worried look on her face. Then Kim goes home and talks to her mom and confirms everything I just said. She tells her mom in a scared tone of voice "I'm going to end up with Ron!" and then her mom tells her she doesn't see what the big deal is and that Ron is a nice guy, Kim then says that "Ron is not a guy." and that he is not boy friend material. Later, when she is walking to school with Monique, she says that Ron and her were cool and she was about to say something nice about him until he rolled up on his childish scooter and said that he was "full of childlike wonder." with another angry look on her face. And then Eric shows up and Kim is completely struck by him. And of course the whole montage of Kim hanging out with Eric while Ron is all alone and depressed. When Kim is having dinner with Her family, Eric and Ron, Ron gets up and leaves because he can't take it anymore and Kim just simply says "bye Ron" and then he gets angry and storms out. You would think that Kim would Run after him, if only to talk to him for a second and see whats wrong. But instead Kim just shrugs him off and tells Eric that "Hes fine." Some friend she is huh? Ron does so much for her and she won't even break away from her boyfriend for a second just to see what's wrong with him. And now onto the worthless tree house scene. And so finally Kim decides to see whats wrong with him and visits him in his tree house. She tells him, "Eric isn't going to change what were all about, we'll always be tight." and the Ron says "Cute words, Kim." translation: Kim: "Ron, I'm with Eric but we will always be friends." Ron: "Yeah right." and then she says it's time to grow up and then Ron says he doesn't want to grow up because.......Well we don't know because Eric calls out for Kim. Apparently, Kim can't even go see Ron without bringing Eric along. And then Kim leaves as soon as Eric calls her name. Kim was talking to Ron for like 2 minutes and then just leaves. "we'll talk more tomorrow" If I were Ron I would have said, "No, lets talk now, You've only been her for 2 minutes." That tree house scene was a great opportunity for Kim and Ron to further their relationship but no dice. Later, Ron is getting ready for the prom and asks 'What if Kim wants Eric and not Me?" This is the biggest mistake in the whole movie, he asks the biggest question ever and WE NEVER GET AN ANSWER! When Eric comes to Kim's house to pick her up for the prom, Kim says "Is it just me or is he perfect?" OK let's recap everything at this point. Kim doesn't think Ron is boyfriend material, she shrugs him off every chance she gets, she hardly pays any attention to Ron, she thinks Eric is perfect. Where are the scenes that show the development on her feelings for Ron? They don't exist. In fact, after Kim says Eric is perfect her mom looks over at a picture of Kim and Ron with a sad look on her face. Now don't you think it would have made a lot more sense to have Kim look at the picture with a sad look on her face? It would have indicated that she was at least thinking of Ron but once again, no. When Ron shows up at the prom and tells Kim about Drakken's plan, she believes him. Some think this is a sign that Kim is still interested in him, I really can't imagine why. Like Kim said "It's a save the world thing." She would be an idiot not to check out the toys. anyway at the end of the movie Eric is a fake and Ron is their to pick Kim up on the rebound. STD made Kim look shallow and Desperate. Their was no scenes with Kim and Ron to make me believe that Kim had any feelings for Ron at all. If they would have had a scene where they almost kiss at the tree house or at least have Kim look at the picture on the wall instead of her mom then I would believe it. STD never had any character development scenes between Kim and Ron, it was all "Kim hangs out with Eric, Ron is all sad." this was basically the whole movie. Neither of them had to over come anything they just got together under circumstance. And what -es me off the most is that Ron is dating Kim but has no idea about all of the crap she was talking about him earlier in the movie. Season 4 is another wasted opportunity to set things right. Season 4 starts with Ron having a dream that Kim is a synthodrone. Why the hell isn't Kim having the nightmares? I don't want to hear anymore of what Ron is feeling we had enough of that in STD. Season 4 should have focus on what Kim was thinking and feeling. because we know what Ron is feeling. what is she feeling? she is the one who went from "Ron isn't Boy friend materiel." to "That's my guy," the second Eric was out of the picture. Kim was so hollow in Season 4 that I just saw her as a secondary character. Every time she said something nice about Ron I could easily find a way around it. Like, "I don't care about dating a jock, I care about dating you." Of course she cares about dating him because he is all she could get and all she will ever get. "You helped me choose you." Yeah, between Ron and No one, she really had a difficult choice to make. all the nice things she said in season 4 were just empty words. They mean nothing because before Eric showed up she dreaded the idea of being with Ron. in fact, before STD she was always against the idea. In the episode where Ron meet Zita for the first time, Kim scoffed at the idea of dating Ron, she also did things similar in other episodes. You K/R shippers can disagree if you want, but you can't beat solid evidence.
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May 4, 2008 20:44:02 GMT -5
Post by Ashfangirl20 on May 4, 2008 20:44:02 GMT -5
Meh I don't really care. I like the way it happened.
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May 17, 2008 12:43:08 GMT -5
Post by The Nine Tailed Smiley on May 17, 2008 12:43:08 GMT -5
I can't believe some people think it was perfect. STD is not perfect, it's the biggest mess I have ever seen in my life. Honestly, do the writers actually expect people to believe that Kim's feeling for Ron were natural? I'm about to go on a long rant, I'm sorry that it's so long but it sums up everything that is wrong with STD: When Bonny told Kim that she needs to get a date or she would end up with the chess captain, then Ron runs into the gym and then she says "or worse" (Implying that Kim would end up with Ron) she has a horrified look on her face. Then at the lockers she is sad when she sees that ever other girl has a boyfriend but her, then Ron shows up and he says that he thinks he knows what she is sad about and Kim turns around with a gasp and a shocked look on her face and then Ron guesses wrong and she then sighs. Now this the part where most K/R fans think that she gasped because she was expecting him to ask her out and that she sighed at the end because he didn't. This is wrong because it is completely contradicted by the scenes that follow. The real reason why she gasped was because she was worried that he WAS going to ask her out and then sighed in relief when he didn't. after Kim signs his petition, she says "no big" and Ron says "No, way big, I can always count on you." This always sounded like Ron was trying to hint to her that he was interested in her. Even though he wasn't, Kim thought he did and walked away with another worried look on her face. Then Kim goes home and talks to her mom and confirms everything I just said. She tells her mom in a scared tone of voice "I'm going to end up with Ron!" and then her mom tells her she doesn't see what the big deal is and that Ron is a nice guy, Kim then says that "Ron is not a guy." and that he is not boy friend material. Later, when she is walking to school with Monique, she says that Ron and her were cool and she was about to say something nice about him until he rolled up on his childish scooter and said that he was "full of childlike wonder." with another angry look on her face. And then Eric shows up and Kim is completely struck by him. And of course the whole montage of Kim hanging out with Eric while Ron is all alone and depressed. When Kim is having dinner with Her family, Eric and Ron, Ron gets up and leaves because he can't take it anymore and Kim just simply says "bye Ron" and then he gets angry and storms out. You would think that Kim would Run after him, if only to talk to him for a second and see whats wrong. But instead Kim just shrugs him off and tells Eric that "Hes fine." Some friend she is huh? Ron does so much for her and she won't even break away from her boyfriend for a second just to see what's wrong with him. And now onto the worthless tree house scene. And so finally Kim decides to see whats wrong with him and visits him in his tree house. She tells him, "Eric isn't going to change what were all about, we'll always be tight." and the Ron says "Cute words, Kim." translation: Kim: "Ron, I'm with Eric but we will always be friends." Ron: "Yeah right." and then she says it's time to grow up and then Ron says he doesn't want to grow up because.......Well we don't know because Eric calls out for Kim. Apparently, Kim can't even go see Ron without bringing Eric along. And then Kim leaves as soon as Eric calls her name. Kim was talking to Ron for like 2 minutes and then just leaves. "we'll talk more tomorrow" If I were Ron I would have said, "No, lets talk now, You've only been her for 2 minutes." That tree house scene was a great opportunity for Kim and Ron to further their relationship but no dice. Later, Ron is getting ready for the prom and asks 'What if Kim wants Eric and not Me?" This is the biggest mistake in the whole movie, he asks the biggest question ever and WE NEVER GET AN ANSWER! When Eric comes to Kim's house to pick her up for the prom, Kim says "Is it just me or is he perfect?" OK let's recap everything at this point. Kim doesn't think Ron is boyfriend material, she shrugs him off every chance she gets, she hardly pays any attention to Ron, she thinks Eric is perfect. Where are the scenes that show the development on her feelings for Ron? They don't exist. In fact, after Kim says Eric is perfect her mom looks over at a picture of Kim and Ron with a sad look on her face. Now don't you think it would have made a lot more sense to have Kim look at the picture with a sad look on her face? It would have indicated that she was at least thinking of Ron but once again, no. When Ron shows up at the prom and tells Kim about Drakken's plan, she believes him. Some think this is a sign that Kim is still interested in him, I really can't imagine why. Like Kim said "It's a save the world thing." She would be an idiot not to check out the toys. anyway at the end of the movie Eric is a fake and Ron is their to pick Kim up on the rebound. STD made Kim look shallow and Desperate. Their was no scenes with Kim and Ron to make me believe that Kim had any feelings for Ron at all. If they would have had a scene where they almost kiss at the tree house or at least have Kim look at the picture on the wall instead of her mom then I would believe it. STD never had any character development scenes between Kim and Ron, it was all "Kim hangs out with Eric, Ron is all sad." this was basically the whole movie. Neither of them had to over come anything they just got together under circumstance. And what -es me off the most is that Ron is dating Kim but has no idea about all of the crap she was talking about him earlier in the movie. Season 4 is another wasted opportunity to set things right. Season 4 starts with Ron having a dream that Kim is a synthodrone. Why the hell isn't Kim having the nightmares? I don't want to hear anymore of what Ron is feeling we had enough of that in STD. Season 4 should have focus on what Kim was thinking and feeling. because we know what Ron is feeling. what is she feeling? she is the one who went from "Ron isn't Boy friend materiel." to "That's my guy," the second Eric was out of the picture. Kim was so hollow in Season 4 that I just saw her as a secondary character. Every time she said something nice about Ron I could easily find a way around it. Like, "I don't care about dating a jock, I care about dating you." Of course she cares about dating him because he is all she could get and all she will ever get. "You helped me choose you." Yeah, between Ron and No one, she really had a difficult choice to make. all the nice things she said in season 4 were just empty words. They mean nothing because before Eric showed up she dreaded the idea of being with Ron. in fact, before STD she was always against the idea. In the episode where Ron meet Zita for the first time, Kim scoffed at the idea of dating Ron, she also did things similar in other episodes. You K/R shippers can disagree if you want, but you can't beat solid evidence. ...wow...you're deep!!I don't really have any way to disprove what you just said but...I LOVE K\R!!!
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May 18, 2008 4:17:05 GMT -5
Post by yvj on May 18, 2008 4:17:05 GMT -5
I can't believe some people think it was perfect. STD is not perfect, it's the biggest mess I have ever seen in my life. Honestly, do the writers actually expect people to believe that Kim's feeling for Ron were natural? I'm about to go on a long rant, I'm sorry that it's so long but it sums up everything that is wrong with STD: When Bonny told Kim that she needs to get a date or she would end up with the chess captain, then Ron runs into the gym and then she says "or worse" (Implying that Kim would end upwith Ron) she has a horrified look on her face. Then at the lockers she is sad when she sees that ever other girl has a boyfriend but her, then Ron shows up and he says that he thinks he knows what she is sad about and Kim turns around with a gasp and a shocked look on her face and then Ron guesses wrong and she then sighs. Now this the part where most K/R fans think that she gasped because she was expecting him to ask her out and that she sighed at the end because he didn't. This is wrong because it is completely contradicted by the scenes that follow. The real reason why she gasped was because she was worried that he WAS going to ask her out and then sighed in relief when he didn't. after Kim signs his petition, she says "no big" and Ron says "No, way big, I can always count on you." This always sounded like Ron was trying to hint to her that he was interested in her. Even though he wasn't, Kim thought he did and walked away with another worried look on her face. Then Kim goes home and talks to her mom and confirms everything I just said. She tells her mom in a scared tone of voice "I'm going to end up with Ron!" and then her mom tells her she doesn't see what the big deal is and that Ron is a nice guy, Kim then says that "Ron is not a guy." and that he is not boy friend material. Later, when she is walking to school with Monique, she says that Ron and her were cool and she was about to say something nice about him until he rolled up on his childish scooter and said that he was "full of childlike wonder." with another angry look on her face. And then Eric shows up and Kim is completely struck by him. And of course the whole montage of Kim hanging out with Eric while Ron is all alone and depressed. When Kim is having dinner with Her family, Eric and Ron, Ron gets up and leaves because he can't take it anymore and Kim just simply says "bye Ron" and then he gets angry and storms out. You would think that Kim would Run after him, if only to talk to him for a second and see whats wrong. But instead Kim just shrugs him off and tells Eric that "Hes fine." Some friend she is huh? Ron does so much for her and she won't even break away from her boyfriend for a second just to see what's wrong with him. And now onto the worthless tree house scene. And so finally Kim decides to see whats wrong with him and visits him in his tree house. She tells him, "Eric isn't going to change what were all about, we'll always be tight." and the Ron says "Cute words, Kim." translation: Kim: "Ron, I'm with Eric but we will always be friends." Ron: "Yeah right." and then she says it's time to grow up and then Ron says he doesn't want to grow up because.......Well we don't know because Eric calls out for Kim. Apparently, Kim can't even go see Ron without bringing Eric along. And then Kim leaves as soon as Eric calls her name. Kim was talking to Ron for like 2 minutes and then just leaves. "we'll talk more tomorrow" If I were Ron I would have said, "No, lets talk now, You've only been her for 2 minutes." That tree house scene was a great opportunity for Kim and Ron to further their relationship but no dice. Later, Ron is getting ready for the prom and asks 'What if Kim wants Eric and not Me?" This is the biggest mistake in the whole movie, he asks the biggest question ever and WE NEVER GET AN ANSWER! When Eric comes to Kim's house to pick her up for the prom, Kim says "Is it just me or is he perfect?" OK let's recap everything at this point. Kim doesn't think Ron is boyfriend material, she shrugs him off every chance she gets, she hardly pays any attention to Ron, she thinks Eric is perfect. Where are the scenes that show the development on her feelings for Ron? They don't exist. In fact, after Kim says Eric is perfect her mom looks over at a picture of Kim and Ron with a sad look on her face. Now don't you think it would have made a lot more sense to have Kim look at the picture with a sad look on her face? It would have indicated that she was at least thinking of Ron but once again, no. When Ron shows up at the prom and tells Kim about Drakken's plan, she believes him. Some think this is a sign that Kim is still interested in him, I really can't imagine why. Like Kim said "It's a save the world thing." She would be an idiot not to check out the toys. anyway at the end of the movie Eric is a fake and Ron is their to pick Kim up on the rebound. STD made Kim look shallow and Desperate. Their was no scenes with Kim and Ron to make me believe that Kim had any feelings for Ron at all. If they would have had a scene where they almost kiss at the tree house or at least have Kim look at the picture on the wall instead of her mom then I would believe it. STD never had any character development scenes between Kim and Ron, it was all "Kim hangs out with Eric, Ron is all sad." this was basically the whole movie. Neither of them had to over come anything they just got together under circumstance. And what -es me off the most is that Ron is dating Kim but has no idea about all of the crap she was talking about him earlier in the movie. Season 4 is another wasted opportunity to set things right. Season 4 starts with Ron having a dream that Kim is a synthodrone. Why the hell isn't Kim having the nightmares? I don't want to hear anymore of what Ron is feeling we had enough of that in STD. Season 4 should have focus on what Kim was thinking and feeling. because we know what Ron is feeling. what is she feeling? she is the one who went from "Ron isn't Boy friend materiel." to "That's my guy," the second Eric was out of the picture. Kim was so hollow in Season 4 that I just saw her as a secondary character. Every time she said something nice about Ron I could easily find a way around it. Like, "I don't care about dating a jock, I care about dating you." Of course she cares about dating him because he is all she could get and all she will ever get. "You helped me choose you." Yeah, between Ron and No one, she really had a difficult choice to make. all the nice things she said in season 4 were just empty words. They mean nothing because before Eric showed up she dreaded the idea of being with Ron. in fact, before STD she was always against the idea. In the episode where Ron meet Zita for the first time, Kim scoffed at the idea of dating Ron, she also did things similar in other episodes. You K/R shippers can disagree if you want, but you can't beat solid evidence. LOL biased much? {yes this is the pot calling the kettle black} Sorry your evidence is about as solid as hydrogen. You've got more opinion in there than actual fact. Although it was nice of you to decide that every and all scenes where Kim shows any and ALL feelings towards Ron during season 4 are "empty" BTW you also missed "I think I love you" from Clean Slate and "nothing will ever come between us" from Graduation. That kiss at the end of graduation must have been an empty act as well eh? Maybe all the kisses were meaningless. Let's also throw in the "googily" look Kim gave Ron when he showed up after she and Wade had been captured in Odds Man In or the sad look she gave Ron when he was in the bubble during Mather and Fervernt (sp?) how about the hug and the following "I didn't think I'd ever be able to do that again" I got another empty phrase "It took twelve stinking years for you to kiss me!" How about Kim's UBER JELLING around Yori or how angry she got with Bonnie's kiss in Homecoming Upset? How about when she was draping herself all over him at the dance at the end of that very same episode? And let's ignore all the hand holding, and every "girlish" look Kim has given Ron throughout season 4. Such shallow forms of affection all of them. Ron was having the dreams because Ron is the insecure one. Ron is the one who throughout the show has shown the most fear. YET if we look carefully we see Kim showing most of her insecurity in the forms of jealousy. Yes Kim scoffed at the at the idea of dating Ron in SEASON TWO if you see Kim's interactions with Ron from earlier seasons as completely the same with Std+ than I don't know what to tell you. First of all even before StD See Season 3 Gorilla Fist, and to a lesser extent See Season 3 Steal Wheels (yes "Ron night" sounds like a very platonic occasion ) Your biggest and most valid argument IMO is that Ron is a rebound. And you might be right on that account, it's very debatable. Unfortunately for Ron during most of StD Kim like the teenage girl that she was, is crushing (similar to the brief Hirotaka stint) on a guy-----machine DESIGNED to be the perfect boyfriend for girls her age. And of course she had no idea that Ron had any feelings for her. Although we do have the "I know what this is about" scene in the school before Ron completely changes the subject. Take that for what it's worth to you. I would personally say "So what" to Ron being a rebound (which I don't believe he was based on Kim's initial feelings in Gorilla fist) the last scene of the show has them kissing and flying off into space. I'd give you more of a rebuttal on the rebounding issue and etc etc but you've probably seen them all already on this site and ignored them. StD ain't perfect, it's pretty good but it's not perfect.
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May 18, 2008 8:36:52 GMT -5
Post by mike on May 18, 2008 8:36:52 GMT -5
You K/R shippers can disagree if you want, but you can't beat solid evidence. What evidence? A story summary with parts that, disagrees with K/R, emphasized?
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Jigsaw
Yellow Trout
"Live or die, make your choice."
Posts: 137
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Change?
May 19, 2008 0:51:59 GMT -5
Post by Jigsaw on May 19, 2008 0:51:59 GMT -5
You K/R shippers can disagree if you want, but you can't beat solid evidence. What evidence? A story summary with parts that, disagrees with K/R, emphasized? Name one part in STD that actually made it clear that Kim was interested in Ron. All signs point out that she thought he was childish and not good enough for her. Only until she realized that she had no alternative, does she go for Ron. I'm not saying Kim doesn't have any feelings for Ron I'm just saying the execution was terrible.
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Jigsaw
Yellow Trout
"Live or die, make your choice."
Posts: 137
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Change?
May 19, 2008 1:40:41 GMT -5
Post by Jigsaw on May 19, 2008 1:40:41 GMT -5
I can't believe some people think it was perfect. STD is not perfect, it's the biggest mess I have ever seen in my life. Honestly, do the writers actually expect people to believe that Kim's feeling for Ron were natural? I'm about to go on a long rant, I'm sorry that it's so long but it sums up everything that is wrong with STD: When Bonny told Kim that she needs to get a date or she would end up with the chess captain, then Ron runs into the gym and then she says "or worse" (Implying that Kim would end upwith Ron) she has a horrified look on her face. Then at the lockers she is sad when she sees that ever other girl has a boyfriend but her, then Ron shows up and he says that he thinks he knows what she is sad about and Kim turns around with a gasp and a shocked look on her face and then Ron guesses wrong and she then sighs. Now this the part where most K/R fans think that she gasped because she was expecting him to ask her out and that she sighed at the end because he didn't. This is wrong because it is completely contradicted by the scenes that follow. The real reason why she gasped was because she was worried that he WAS going to ask her out and then sighed in relief when he didn't. after Kim signs his petition, she says "no big" and Ron says "No, way big, I can always count on you." This always sounded like Ron was trying to hint to her that he was interested in her. Even though he wasn't, Kim thought he did and walked away with another worried look on her face. Then Kim goes home and talks to her mom and confirms everything I just said. She tells her mom in a scared tone of voice "I'm going to end up with Ron!" and then her mom tells her she doesn't see what the big deal is and that Ron is a nice guy, Kim then says that "Ron is not a guy." and that he is not boy friend material. Later, when she is walking to school with Monique, she says that Ron and her were cool and she was about to say something nice about him until he rolled up on his childish scooter and said that he was "full of childlike wonder." with another angry look on her face. And then Eric shows up and Kim is completely struck by him. And of course the whole montage of Kim hanging out with Eric while Ron is all alone and depressed. When Kim is having dinner with Her family, Eric and Ron, Ron gets up and leaves because he can't take it anymore and Kim just simply says "bye Ron" and then he gets angry and storms out. You would think that Kim would Run after him, if only to talk to him for a second and see whats wrong. But instead Kim just shrugs him off and tells Eric that "Hes fine." Some friend she is huh? Ron does so much for her and she won't even break away from her boyfriend for a second just to see what's wrong with him. And now onto the worthless tree house scene. And so finally Kim decides to see whats wrong with him and visits him in his tree house. She tells him, "Eric isn't going to change what were all about, we'll always be tight." and the Ron says "Cute words, Kim." translation: Kim: "Ron, I'm with Eric but we will always be friends." Ron: "Yeah right." and then she says it's time to grow up and then Ron says he doesn't want to grow up because.......Well we don't know because Eric calls out for Kim. Apparently, Kim can't even go see Ron without bringing Eric along. And then Kim leaves as soon as Eric calls her name. Kim was talking to Ron for like 2 minutes and then just leaves. "we'll talk more tomorrow" If I were Ron I would have said, "No, lets talk now, You've only been her for 2 minutes." That tree house scene was a great opportunity for Kim and Ron to further their relationship but no dice. Later, Ron is getting ready for the prom and asks 'What if Kim wants Eric and not Me?" This is the biggest mistake in the whole movie, he asks the biggest question ever and WE NEVER GET AN ANSWER! When Eric comes to Kim's house to pick her up for the prom, Kim says "Is it just me or is he perfect?" OK let's recap everything at this point. Kim doesn't think Ron is boyfriend material, she shrugs him off every chance she gets, she hardly pays any attention to Ron, she thinks Eric is perfect. Where are the scenes that show the development on her feelings for Ron? They don't exist. In fact, after Kim says Eric is perfect her mom looks over at a picture of Kim and Ron with a sad look on her face. Now don't you think it would have made a lot more sense to have Kim look at the picture with a sad look on her face? It would have indicated that she was at least thinking of Ron but once again, no. When Ron shows up at the prom and tells Kim about Drakken's plan, she believes him. Some think this is a sign that Kim is still interested in him, I really can't imagine why. Like Kim said "It's a save the world thing." She would be an idiot not to check out the toys. anyway at the end of the movie Eric is a fake and Ron is their to pick Kim up on the rebound. STD made Kim look shallow and Desperate. Their was no scenes with Kim and Ron to make me believe that Kim had any feelings for Ron at all. If they would have had a scene where they almost kiss at the tree house or at least have Kim look at the picture on the wall instead of her mom then I would believe it. STD never had any character development scenes between Kim and Ron, it was all "Kim hangs out with Eric, Ron is all sad." this was basically the whole movie. Neither of them had to over come anything they just got together under circumstance. And what -es me off the most is that Ron is dating Kim but has no idea about all of the crap she was talking about him earlier in the movie. Season 4 is another wasted opportunity to set things right. Season 4 starts with Ron having a dream that Kim is a synthodrone. Why the hell isn't Kim having the nightmares? I don't want to hear anymore of what Ron is feeling we had enough of that in STD. Season 4 should have focus on what Kim was thinking and feeling. because we know what Ron is feeling. what is she feeling? she is the one who went from "Ron isn't Boy friend materiel." to "That's my guy," the second Eric was out of the picture. Kim was so hollow in Season 4 that I just saw her as a secondary character. Every time she said something nice about Ron I could easily find a way around it. Like, "I don't care about dating a jock, I care about dating you." Of course she cares about dating him because he is all she could get and all she will ever get. "You helped me choose you." Yeah, between Ron and No one, she really had a difficult choice to make. all the nice things she said in season 4 were just empty words. They mean nothing because before Eric showed up she dreaded the idea of being with Ron. in fact, before STD she was always against the idea. In the episode where Ron meet Zita for the first time, Kim scoffed at the idea of dating Ron, she also did things similar in other episodes. You K/R shippers can disagree if you want, but you can't beat solid evidence. LOL biased much? {yes this is the pot calling the kettle black} Sorry your evidence is about as solid as hydrogen. You've got more opinion in there than actual fact. Although it was nice of you to decide that every and all scenes where Kim shows any and ALL feelings towards Ron during season 4 are "empty" BTW you also missed "I think I love you" from Clean Slate and "nothing will ever come between us" from Graduation. That kiss at the end of graduation must have been an empty act as well eh? Maybe all the kisses were meaningless. Let's also throw in the "googily" look Kim gave Ron when he showed up after she and Wade had been captured in Odds Man In or the sad look she gave Ron when he was in the bubble during Mather and Fervernt (sp?) how about the hug and the following "I didn't think I'd ever be able to do that again" I got another empty phrase "It took twelve stinking years for you to kiss me!" How about Kim's UBER JELLING around Yori or how angry she got with Bonnie's kiss in Homecoming Upset? How about when she was draping herself all over him at the dance at the end of that very same episode? And let's ignore all the hand holding, and every "girlish" look Kim has given Ron throughout season 4. Such shallow forms of affection all of them. Ron was having the dreams because Ron is the insecure one. Ron is the one who throughout the show has shown the most fear. YET if we look carefully we see Kim showing most of her insecurity in the forms of jealousy. Yes Kim scoffed at the at the idea of dating Ron in SEASON TWO if you see Kim's interactions with Ron from earlier seasons as completely the same with Std+ than I don't know what to tell you. First of all even before StD See Season 3 Gorilla Fist, and to a lesser extent See Season 3 Steal Wheels (yes "Ron night" sounds like a very platonic occasion ) Your biggest and most valid argument IMO is that Ron is a rebound. And you might be right on that account, it's very debatable. Unfortunately for Ron during most of StD Kim like the teenage girl that she was, is crushing (similar to the brief Hirotaka stint) on a guy-----machine DESIGNED to be the perfect boyfriend for girls her age. And of course she had no idea that Ron had any feelings for her. Although we do have the "I know what this is about" scene in the school before Ron completely changes the subject. Take that for what it's worth to you. I would personally say "So what" to Ron being a rebound (which I don't believe he was based on Kim's initial feelings in Gorilla fist) the last scene of the show has them kissing and flying off into space. I'd give you more of a rebuttal on the rebounding issue and etc etc but you've probably seen them all already on this site and ignored them. StD ain't perfect, it's pretty good but it's not perfect. Like I said before, I'm not talking about weather or not Kim had feeling for Ron or not, I'm talking about the lack of focus in STD that would make me believe that Kim had feelings for Ron. seriously, the whole movie is just Kim dating Eric while Ron is being depressed and making it clear how HE feels about Kim while Kim does nothing but laugh it up with Eric until he turns out to be a fake. This is the biggest moment in the series, the moment where Kim and Ron get together and the best they can do is the small"out there, in here" bit at the end when there was no conflict left? Everything Kim says and does in Season 4, to me, is empty because they are complete contradictions of what she says and does earlier in the series. like the time when they went on their first date and Ron was acting childish and she is disgusted with him and yet at the end of the episode she smiles at his behavior like she's OK with it. It makes it look like she really is just settling for what she can get. also, the whole "It took you 12 years to kiss me" would imply that she was waiting for him for 12 years and anybody who has seen seasons 1-3 knows that couldn't be more further from the truth. Her just saying pretty words means nothing because I can just say "that's not what she said last time." She should explain what she is thinking and feeling like what Ron does all the time. Kim never seems to do that, at least not when it matters the most. Kim doesn't get nearly as much focus and attention as Ron does from the writers. That makes her a secondary character to me. But then again I remember That this show was never really her show in the first place, it was always Ron's........but that's a different argument for another thread. STD seems to ignore Gorilla Fist: instead of making it clear that she wants to be with him it make it perfectly clear that she doesn't want to be with him. it's like Kim became a whole different person in STD. There are continuity errors and contradictions throughout the series. I just wish the Writers would pay a little more attention to detail. especially to the one aspect that matters most (k/R).
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May 19, 2008 4:05:55 GMT -5
Post by yvj on May 19, 2008 4:05:55 GMT -5
LOL biased much? {yes this is the pot calling the kettle black} Sorry your evidence is about as solid as hydrogen. You've got more opinion in there than actual fact. Although it was nice of you to decide that every and all scenes where Kim shows any and ALL feelings towards Ron during season 4 are "empty" BTW you also missed "I think I love you" from Clean Slate and "nothing will ever come between us" from Graduation. That kiss at the end of graduation must have been an empty act as well eh? Maybe all the kisses were meaningless. Let's also throw in the "googily" look Kim gave Ron when he showed up after she and Wade had been captured in Odds Man In or the sad look she gave Ron when he was in the bubble during Mather and Fervernt (sp?) how about the hug and the following "I didn't think I'd ever be able to do that again" I got another empty phrase "It took twelve stinking years for you to kiss me!" How about Kim's UBER JELLING around Yori or how angry she got with Bonnie's kiss in Homecoming Upset? How about when she was draping herself all over him at the dance at the end of that very same episode? And let's ignore all the hand holding, and every "girlish" look Kim has given Ron throughout season 4. Such shallow forms of affection all of them. Ron was having the dreams because Ron is the insecure one. Ron is the one who throughout the show has shown the most fear. YET if we look carefully we see Kim showing most of her insecurity in the forms of jealousy. Yes Kim scoffed at the at the idea of dating Ron in SEASON TWO if you see Kim's interactions with Ron from earlier seasons as completely the same with Std+ than I don't know what to tell you. First of all even before StD See Season 3 Gorilla Fist, and to a lesser extent See Season 3 Steal Wheels (yes "Ron night" sounds like a very platonic occasion ) Your biggest and most valid argument IMO is that Ron is a rebound. And you might be right on that account, it's very debatable. Unfortunately for Ron during most of StD Kim like the teenage girl that she was, is crushing (similar to the brief Hirotaka stint) on a guy-----machine DESIGNED to be the perfect boyfriend for girls her age. And of course she had no idea that Ron had any feelings for her. Although we do have the "I know what this is about" scene in the school before Ron completely changes the subject. Take that for what it's worth to you. I would personally say "So what" to Ron being a rebound (which I don't believe he was based on Kim's initial feelings in Gorilla fist) the last scene of the show has them kissing and flying off into space. I'd give you more of a rebuttal on the rebounding issue and etc etc but you've probably seen them all already on this site and ignored them. StD ain't perfect, it's pretty good but it's not perfect. Like I said before, I'm not talking about weather or not Kim had feeling for Ron or not, I'm talking about the lack of focus in STD that would make me believe that Kim had feelings for Ron. seriously, the whole movie is just Kim dating Eric while Ron is being depressed and making it clear how HE feels about Kim while Kim does nothing but laugh it up with Eric until he turns out to be a fake. This is the biggest moment in the series, the moment where Kim and Ron get together and the best they can do is the small"out there, in here" bit at the end when there was no conflict left? Everything Kim says and does in Season 4, to me, is empty because they are complete contradictions of what she says and does earlier in the series. like the time when they went on their first date and Ron was acting childish and she is disgusted with him and yet at the end of the episode she smiles at his behavior like she's OK with it. It makes it look like she really is just settling for what she can get. also, the whole "It took you 12 years to kiss me" would imply that she was waiting for him for 12 years and anybody who has seen seasons 1-3 knows that couldn't be more further from the truth. Her just saying pretty words means nothing because I can just say "that's not what she said last time." She should explain what she is thinking and feeling like what Ron does all the time. Kim never seems to do that, at least not when it matters the most. Kim doesn't get nearly as much focus and attention as Ron does from the writers. That makes her a secondary character to me. But then again I remember That this show was never really her show in the first place, it was always Ron's........but that's a different argument for another thread. STD seems to ignore Gorilla Fist: instead of making it clear that she wants to be with him it make it perfectly clear that she doesn't want to be with him. it's like Kim became a whole different person in STD. There are continuity errors and contradictions throughout the series. I just wish the Writers would pay a little more attention to detail. especially to the one aspect that matters most (k/R). Well I can't make the StD any better for you, since it's a truly subjective matter. So I'm not going to argue with you about how you perceived the movie's execution because those kinds of arguments lead down bad roads. I personally wouldn't have minded a bit more conflict as well or a little more to the ending. But it wasn't bad (to me anyway) what it was is a very neat wrap up to the (supposed) end of the series. Which fit well into the overall tone of the show. I'm not going to tell you StD wasn't cliche because it was most definitely. And I'm not going to tell you there aren't continuity errors and contradictions in the series, because there is. Now on to some points, I mentioned earlier you may not believe it but from what I've seen between season two and three Kim indeed mellowed out, especially in terms of her interactions with Ron. Additionally I don't understand why you find it difficult to see Kim being very annoyed with Ron in one instance and being affectionate later on. Is it really that far fetched to you? If there has been a relationship be it fictional or "real" that has not had a moment like this. I'd like to see it. Or more specifically a girlfriend thinking her boyfriend is having a childish moment, and then afterward they fall back to their affectionate ways. That is pretty much a given in my eyes for a relationship. Another thing is do you honestly see Kim as the type to settle? I don't see where you're coming from with that. I mean to what point would she be "settling" for? A guy who was her best friend through most of her life {insert Ron's good qualities here}. If you do feel that she is settling. That is all well in good. I do not. I see the the "twelve years line" is a case of hindsight in it's purest form. She didn't see it then obviously, but she sees it now. The case can be made that the fact the she said such a statement means she is now seeing the relationship as something that was inevitable. You could easily say her statement shows that she believes their relationship was a gradual build. I'm pretty sure that pre season 3, Kim hadn't entertained the idea of dating Ron. But of course in Gorilla fist where she was clearly showing feelings of jealously, even then it probably at that moment still didn't occur to her what the sitch really was. Now your point that Kim doesn't explain herself outright as Ron does, is a good one. And is an interesting topic. But if you don't see any validity to Kim's words but you see Kim as the type who "explains" herself mostly through her actions (as some do), then from her grabbing Ron by the hand and pulling him along at the end of StD to the last frames of Graduation, you can say we've seen more than enough from Kim in season 4 in terms of body language (among other things IMO) to be able to gauge what Kim's inner monologue might be. I agree that Season 4 is undoubtedly about Ron, from showcasing his insecurities from Ill Suited to Graduation pt 1 and finally to him ubering out in Graduation pt 2. As for the other seasons I very much disagree, Kim had major focus throughout Season 1-2 and at the very least you can say Season 3 was based on Team Possible equally. Again though if you wanted the writers to add more conflict or to delve more deeply into K/R I wouldn't have been against it.
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May 19, 2008 4:28:13 GMT -5
Post by yvj on May 19, 2008 4:28:13 GMT -5
What evidence? A story summary with parts that, disagrees with K/R, emphasized? Name one part in STD that actually made it clear that Kim was interested in Ron. All signs point out that she thought he was childish and not good enough for her. Only until she realized that she had no alternative, does she go for Ron. I'm not saying Kim doesn't have any feelings for Ron I'm just saying the execution was terrible. Yes most of StD was pointing out that Kim had (because of Bonnie's teasing and the pressures of "teenage status") at that point become completely wrapped up in the food chain she even openly admitted it herself. Kim: The person you go with, it makes a statement. She had completely bought into Bonnie's world and all of sudden BAM here comes the perfectly designed boyfriend. She didn't break out of the food chain mode until yes Eric screwed her over, AND Ron helped her out of her funk AND he revealed that he had feelings for her as well. Up until then she didn't even know that Ron liked her. She was clearly surprised by the "out there in here" situation. Cliche yes, but not poorly executed. Typical geek gets dream girl fare.
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May 28, 2008 0:42:08 GMT -5
Post by The Nine Tailed Smiley on May 28, 2008 0:42:08 GMT -5
They've just been through some hardships that they overcame!Most people have crushes and some dates before they find the "right one"!
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Jun 1, 2008 19:55:38 GMT -5
Post by slicknickshady on Jun 1, 2008 19:55:38 GMT -5
I hated the angst in STD but at the end of the day Ron & Kim are together forever and thats all that matter. I would have liked it less angsty but it turned out alright. I felt so bad for Ron during parts of STD though. "I'm losing everything I ever cared about! " Poor Ron. It all turned out good though. I may respond to jugsaws rant late but right now I don't have near the time or energy. STD was far from perfect but at the end of the day K/R is forever according to TPTB/MBS and well if the creators say they are together forever then well that pretty much sums up perfection. Also look at what YVJ said....The episode Gorillia Fist takes place before So The Drama and Kim is clearly jelling. So Kim was Jelling over Yori before Ron was Jelling over Eric. So i'm done. lol. I personally wouldn't have minded a bit more conflict. See we don't agree on everything. I hate conflict and angst. It freaks me out.
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Post by Ot@ru on Jun 2, 2008 3:38:12 GMT -5
What is important now is that they're now together I mean as a couple not just best friends
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Jun 11, 2008 22:59:06 GMT -5
Post by Cody MacArthur Fett on Jun 11, 2008 22:59:06 GMT -5
Personally I wouldn't change a goramn thing. So the Drama was the last Disney movie I really loved, and one of my top five favorite movies of all time. It had action, it had comedy, it had angst, and, yes, it had an ending that made me smile in a truly unique way. And you know what? Given the chance the only thing I would have done differently was to have given the development team a far bigger budget and pay raises all around. So yeah, I loved it, five out of five.
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Aug 8, 2008 14:33:58 GMT -5
Post by lovethebeardkevin on Aug 8, 2008 14:33:58 GMT -5
I think while they were dancing in the end there should have been some dialogue between them like saying I love you or something
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Aug 8, 2008 14:47:02 GMT -5
Post by kimronfangurl on Aug 8, 2008 14:47:02 GMT -5
I think while they were dancing in the end there should have been some dialogue between them like saying I love you or something yea, that would have been a nice touch
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